K1 vs KP, Opinions?
Quote from Cory MabenInteresting about the z8. I think you're right, the mirror box/pentaprism does them them the impression of size, but in my experiences DSLRs tend to not be very big unless you get the one's with integrated vertical grips.
I concluded the Pentax is actually pretty small for what it is after comparing a few more recent(ish) mirrorless full-frame cameras on cameradecision.com
Quote from grover on May 14, 2024, 5:26 pmQuote from Cory MabenInteresting about the z8. I think you're right, the mirror box/pentaprism does them them the impression of size, but in my experiences DSLRs tend to not be very big unless you get the one's with integrated vertical grips.
I concluded the Pentax is actually pretty small for what it is after comparing a few more recent(ish) mirrorless full-frame cameras on cameradecision.com
I love that website, it's very handy! But I agree, I think the K-1 is the perfect size. You can get smaller cameras, my a7r3 was a lot smaller and had many similar specs (IBIS, high res full frame sensor, tilting screen). But it was too small, it's grip was cramped and uncomfortable and my knuckles would hit larger diameter lenses. But the K-1 is large enough to not have those ergonomic issues and so far the weight has not bothered me at all. Making me think that body weight is less important than lens weight because of leverage it's much less tiring to hold a heavy body with a light lens than the other way around. The K-1 has been extremely comfortable.
I, too, thought the K-1 was a large beast based on people's comments. Then I had a D500 briefly and it was so much larger than my K-3iii I compared the D500 and K-1 on cameradecision.com. To my surprise the D500, an APS-C camera, is larger! I think the K-1 would be about perfect ergonomically, as I'm finding my Pentax APS-C camera bodies induce hand cramps now, but are fine with the battery grips. And I do not have large hands. Side note, what helps with that is to mainly support the camera with your left hand and have a loose grip with your right hand.
Quote from JBP on May 23, 2024, 3:41 pmI, too, thought the K-1 was a large beast based on people's comments. Then I had a D500 briefly and it was so much larger than my K-3iii I compared the D500 and K-1 on cameradecision.com. To my surprise the D500, an APS-C camera, is larger! I think the K-1 would be about perfect ergonomically, as I'm finding my Pentax APS-C camera bodies induce hand cramps now, but are fine with the battery grips. And I do not have large hands. Side note, what helps with that is to mainly support the camera with your left hand and have a loose grip with your right hand.
That is a complaint I remember reading/hearing from people talking about the k3/kp. The grip just not being long enough for their whole hand. I think it's just the weight of the camera that puts people off. As I mentioned before, so far it's been no problem at all for me. I have even used it one handed. It's probably one of the best designed grips on a camera I've used.
What I've also found in my setup is that the K-1 is a supporting camera to my film cameras. It's great for experimentation, exploring the character of a lens without spending money every time I press the shutter. It's also good for getting out when it the weather isn't great. Then also scanning the film. There is something very satisfying about the feeling of it being a complete, self-contained system.
Quote from Cory Maben on May 23, 2024, 9:42 pmQuote from JBP on May 23, 2024, 3:41 pmI, too, thought the K-1 was a large beast based on people's comments. Then I had a D500 briefly and it was so much larger than my K-3iii I compared the D500 and K-1 on cameradecision.com. To my surprise the D500, an APS-C camera, is larger! I think the K-1 would be about perfect ergonomically, as I'm finding my Pentax APS-C camera bodies induce hand cramps now, but are fine with the battery grips. And I do not have large hands. Side note, what helps with that is to mainly support the camera with your left hand and have a loose grip with your right hand.
That is a complaint I remember reading/hearing from people talking about the k3/kp. The grip just not being long enough for their whole hand. I think it's just the weight of the camera that puts people off. As I mentioned before, so far it's been no problem at all for me. I have even used it one handed. It's probably one of the best designed grips on a camera I've used.
What I've also found in my setup is that the K-1 is a supporting camera to my film cameras. It's great for experimentation, exploring the character of a lens without spending money every time I press the shutter. It's also good for getting out when it the weather isn't great. Then also scanning the film. There is something very satisfying about the feeling of it being a complete, self-contained system.
Yes, I don't think I mentioned that, but that's exactly the issue. Just a tad too short. It was the extra height of the D500 that kept my hand comfy, and the battery grip on the K-3.
That's how I feel about my K-3, it's my do-it-all camera. I think the K-1 may be even better overall. Better grip, use legacy glass to its full potential, tilt screen.
Quote from Cory Maben on May 16, 2024, 4:59 amI think the K-1 is the perfect size. You can get smaller cameras, my a7r3 was a lot smaller and had many similar specs (IBIS, high res full frame sensor, tilting screen). But it was too small, it's grip was cramped and uncomfortable and my knuckles would hit larger diameter lenses. But the K-1 is large enough to not have those ergonomic issues and so far the weight has not bothered me at all. Making me think that body weight is less important than lens weight because of leverage it's much less tiring to hold a heavy body with a light lens than the other way around. The K-1 has been extremely comfortable.
Now that you've had your K-1 for a bit, I'd be curious to hear your thoughts on the A7R3 vs the K-1.
Stuff like:
- your take on lens selection between the two systems
- when you'd use one camera vs the other.
- the think you miss most about the a7r3 when you are using your K-1 and vice-versa
I'm probably not a great person to ask about the lens selection, I think I only ever owned 2 E mount lenses. Initially when I got the camera I intended to solely use my SA mount lenses via Sigma's MC11 adapter. But as it turned out I found the SA lenses far too unwieldy on the a7r3's body so I rarely, if ever used them. What I actually ended up doing was adapting vintage F mount lenses for 90% of my shooting. Which was a nice experience with the focus peaking and focus magnification making focusing really effortless. That is an advantage of the Sony, the K-1 isn't as good with manual glass. The OVF is nice and clear, I just never feel as confident on the K-1 with manual lenses.
Both cameras have messy menu systems. The Sony at least had a customizable 'Favorites' section, but I haven't found any similar thing on my K-1. I find it kind of annoying I have to scroll all the way over to the 'wrench page 3' to format my cards every time.
The ergonomics I've already talked about. The K-1's body is the one I'd choose if I were able to built a camera ala cart. It's the best grip and button layout I've ever used ever on any camera. Although I have to say my SD1 convinced me that vertical front dials feel more natural to use for me. I think the top 'menu' dial or whatever it's called is actually ingenious and I love it.
Obviously the tilt functionality is superior on the K-1, the K-1 has the most advanced tilt screen in existence, although I do wish it had a portrait orientation tilt like some of the Fuji cameras (which the Sony didn't have either)
I never actually owned the cameras at the same time, so I cannot speak to when I'd use one over the other. I sold my a7r3 back in April of 2023 and honestly I haven't missed it at all. I spoke in previous threads about my dislike of the image quality. I felt like it had an uncanny and hyperreal character that I really struggled with. I haven't noticed that at all with the K-1 and I don't really have any idea on what to blame it on.
But if I were to imagine a scenario where I might miss the a7r3, it would be during night shooting. Being a mirrorless is an obvious advantage, not needing to strictly rely on metering and I found the Sony's highlight metering mode to be very good and I never really struggled to get something properly exposed, that combined with the better manual focusing features made it effortless to shoot with at night and be confident in what I was getting.
I could also imagine the Sony being better for discrete shooting. The K-1 looks like what people think of as a "pro camera" aka a DSLR, so people would pay more attention to me. In fact last summer I went to a local carnival and I planned to bring both my SD1 (which is the same size as the K-1) and shoot it during the late afternoon and after the sun set I would switch to my a7r3, being the better low light camera. But I found almost immediately it was very awkward to shoot the SD1, with the larger body and much larger lenses everyone was paying attention to me and some people were clearly made uncomfortable by it and I ended up switching it out after maybe 45 minutes. Absolutely no one paid any attention to me using the Sony. But now, in that kind of discrete situation I would just grab my Pentax LX, which is a cool think about K mount. It is so old that there are many types of body designs that basically you can have any style of shooting you want as long and use only one set of lenses. The LX reminds me a lot of my X-T3, and having that versatility while only needing to bring one set of lenses is so nice.
That's about all I have to say. I can't really tell you about the image fidelity between the two despite what my thread about pixel peeping my Foveons suggests, I do not normally pay that close of attention to sharpness and detail and that kind of thing, I am typically far more concerned with the vibes of an image that a camera produces.
Sorry if I just rambled, but I hope you found some part of that useful/interesting and if there is something you want to know I didn't touch on, feel free to ask
Quote from Cory Maben on May 27, 2024, 8:13 amSorry if I just rambled, but I hope you found some part of that useful/interesting and if there is something you want to know I didn't touch on, feel free to ask
That was great! Not rambling at all. I just wanted to hear from someone that has recently gone from a top-shelf mirrorless camera to what many consider a dated DSLR. As a K-1 ii user myself, I occasionally wonder if I've been living under a rock and don't know what I'm missing out on.
My only wish is for a modern two lens landscape setup to cover roughly 16mm to 250mm. Sharp, light, weather sealed, f4.0 constant would be ideal. As time goes on I'm starting to appreciate using small primes on the K-1 more just to keep the package a bit more nimble.
I found your comment about the Sony interesting: "it had an uncanny and hyperreal character that I really struggled with". I've heard some complaints about Sony colors. Is this something that is hard to correct when editing a raw?
Quote from grover on May 27, 2024, 5:03 pmQuote from Cory Maben on May 27, 2024, 8:13 amSorry if I just rambled, but I hope you found some part of that useful/interesting and if there is something you want to know I didn't touch on, feel free to ask
That was great! Not rambling at all. I just wanted to hear from someone that has recently gone from a top-shelf mirrorless camera to what many consider a dated DSLR. As a K-1 ii user myself, I occasionally wonder if I've been living under a rock and don't know what I'm missing out on.
My only wish is for a modern two lens landscape setup to cover roughly 16mm to 250mm. Sharp, light, weather sealed, f4.0 constant would be ideal. As time goes on I'm starting to appreciate using small primes on the K-1 more just to keep the package a bit more nimble.
I found your comment about the Sony interesting: "it had an uncanny and hyperreal character that I really struggled with". I've heard some complaints about Sony colors. Is this something that is hard to correct when editing a raw?
I have heard those same complaints about the color, but I never thought anything was wrong with the colors. It was more about the character. I think the most accurate way to describe it is that it felt like the 'soap opera effect' but for photos. Which, if you don't know, is an effect people report when they watch videos which are recorded at framerates above 24 fps. The 'magic' of the production evaporates for some reason and you become fully aware that you're watching people on a set in costumes rather than something that's actually happening.
That's how it felt when I took photos with it. I could no longer connect with the emotional aspects of it. Instead of thinking 'that's a moody night shot with colorful lighting and some sad, nostalgic vibes' it became 'that's that corner store in town next to the coffee shop'. I have some theories about why this happened, but it's just wild speculation on my part.
It's funny that you say "from a top-shelf mirrorless camera to what many consider a dated DSLR". I just checked their release dates and they released about a year and a half apart, with the Pentax being the older of the two. I think that the sentiment is true in a fashion though, that they feel like radically different cameras from different eras despite the fact they are contemporaries and I think it is part of the reason I am more satisfied with K-1. Personally I don't feel like you're missing out on anything, but also there is something to be said about experimentation and if you have a reoccurring nagging thought sometimes is nice to know through experience instead of rationalization. If you have the money to play around with, maybe it's worth finding out.
"My only wish is for a modern two lens landscape setup to cover roughly 16mm to 250mm. Sharp, light, weather sealed, f4.0 constant would be ideal."
I was going to say micro four thirds, but I think you already have one, correct? It would be hard to find those wider focal lengths probably. But I'm not sure really, maybe a Nikon Z6/7 might fit the bill?
